Cathi, 62, Leicester
Occupation Spoken-word artist and poet
Voting record Unhappily, Labour. Used to vote Labour happily
Amuse bouche Cathi was once the poet at an evening of burlesque and erotica. She was not the poet they were expecting, being very dressed, apart from anything else
Emily, 23, Bristol
Occupation Researcher at a communications consultancy
Voting record Labour both times, but did not align with Corbyn, his politics or his leadership
Amuse bouche Walked up a 3,700-metre mountain in Nike Air Force trainers. In Indonesia. She fell over every five metres, and ended up twisting her knee
For starters
Cathi She’s delightful – younger than my daughter, which was weird. Considerably younger, like five years, but she was a proper grownup, charming.
Emily My first impressions were, “What a chic, stylish woman.” Not intimidating in a bad way, more, like, “Wow, this woman’s really cool.”
Cathi It was upmarket Greek food, delicious.
Emily We shared hummus, whipped feta and flatbreads. I had a lamb kofta and Cathi had chicken shish.
The big beef
Emily She’s a big fan of Corbyn, thinks Starmer is slimy, a career politician. I think he’s the best thing that’s happened to the Labour party for a long time. Labour comms are awful, and that doesn’t help. When the government does something really positive, you’d be hard-pressed to find anything in the mainstream news about it. My parents don’t often read the good coming out of government policy, because the right are controlling the media and they’re out to crucify Starmer.
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Cathi We could have had a socialist government that could have changed Britain. I’m very sad that policies have gone to the wind with their drive to be electable. I have come very late in life to the private rental sector, and it’s horrific on every level. And the Labour party could have put a much stronger rent reform bill and made people like me not live in actual terror. Emily is very young, and she really wants a Labour government to succeed. She works for an organisation that does political research. And no shade on her, she’d like to work for the party.
Emily I work around property and development. The government has released loads of money to push through new housing, which is desperately needed.
Cathi She talked about an enormous affordable housing project, and if that happens, I’ll change my view. But I’m not optimistic. Emily was very clear that she thought Keir Starmer had strong values, which she shared. I’ll believe it when I see it.
Sharing plate
Cathi I can’t remember if I’m a second-or third-wave feminist, I lose track. Her feeling, anyway, was that feminists in my age group are quite puritanical about sex workers, and also see them as victims. She knows a lot about this, and she changed my mind. I assumed that the majority of sex workers were substance abusers, and she was saying that’s not the case. It pays better than care work or cleaning work. Most sex workers in England are parents.
Emily She’s like an old guard, second-wave feminist, which I really respect. She was at Greenham Common, which I think is beyond the coolest thing in the world, but yes, she did come at it from a pretty de facto “sex work is wrong” stance. I find that problematic.
For afters
Cathi We talked about how student numbers are too high. Not everyone is bright enough to go to university. A 2:2 from a former polytechnic is not a marketable commodity. So many young people have been lied to about where a degree can take them in life.
Emily Even at Bristol, one of the best Russell Group universities in the country, there are some degrees that I think have no career trajectory, and no prestige. No employer will see it and think, “Ah, that’s a good-quality degree.”
Takeaways
Cathi I cannot stress enough what a lovely time we had.
Emily She’s so cool, she’s lived through so much and has so much political wisdom. It was a real privilege to spend time with her.
Additional reporting: Kitty Drake
